Building the Right Team for Your International Move: Integrated Financial Planning for British Expats | Ask An Expert with Holly Caulder and Aidan Grant

You need a cross-border advisory team to navigate complex international tax laws before it’s too late. Investing in pre-planning before moving to a new country is crucial to avoid financial pitfalls.

This week, you’ll hear from Holly Caulder – dual-qualified U.S. and U.K. tax advisor at Buzzacott, and Aidan Grant – U.K. tax and estate planning attorney at Collyer Bristow as they unpack the financial logistics of moving between the U.K. and the U.S.

Host Richard Taylor – dual U.K./U.S. citizen and Chartered Financial Planner leads a conversation alongside Holly Caulder and Aidan Grant, delving into the complexities faced by British expats navigating the U.S.-U.K. cross border financial landscape. They explore common planning opportunities and the essential role of a coordinated cross-border advisory team.  

In this episode, Richard, Holly & Aidan explore:

• When residency for tax purposes starts.
• The critical timing of tax and legal planning before moving to the U.S.
• Reporting requirements for non-U.S. financial accounts and the consequences of ignoring them.
• The issue of Passive Foreign Investment Companies (PFICs) and how they are taxed.
• Challenges with holding ISAs in the U.S. and unexpected U.S. tax implications.
• Complications and opportunities in estate planning across borders, especially involving trusts.

More about We’re The Brits In America:

With the right financial advice, landmines that threaten expat wealth can be avoided. Often encountered by U.S.-connected expats, these financial landmines are more numerous, more hazardous, and less understood than almost anywhere else in the world. As a result, non-cross border professionals, wealth advisors, and even international advisors are often unaware of them. But don’t worry, We’re The Brits In America has you covered.

We’re The Brits In America is dedicated to helping ambitious U.S.-connected expats and immigrants navigate those challenges — and thrive. Whether you’ve moved to the U.S. for opportunity, or are an American seeking adventure and growth abroad, our job is to equip you with the tools and insights you need to succeed.

If you’re enjoying the show, please consider leaving a 5 star rating and review to help the mission, which is to help expats and immigrants thrive in America. Visit planfirstwealth.com to learn more about our services and connect with Richard Taylor on LinkedIn.

We’re the Brits in America is affiliated with Plan First Wealth LLC, an SEC-registered investment advisor. The views and opinions expressed in this program are those of the speakers and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions of Plan First Wealth.

Information presented is for educational purposes only and does not intend to make an offer or solicitation for the sale or purchase of any specific securities, investments, or investment strategies. Investments involve risk and unless otherwise stated, are not guaranteed. Be sure to first consult with a qualified financial adviser and/or tax professional before implementing any strategy discussed herein. Plan First Wealth does not provide any tax and/or legal advice and strongly recommends that listeners seek their own advice in these areas.

About Richard

Richard Taylor is a British expat, dual citizen (UK & US). Originally from Bolton, he now lives in Greenwich, CT, where Plan First Wealth has its head office.

As the firm’s leader, Richard launched Taylor & Taylor, now Plan First Wealth, and continues to fuel the firm’s growth. Richard is a Chartered Financial Planner (UK – CII) in addition to holding the IMC (CFA UK) and Series 65 (US – FINRA).

Connect with Richard on LinkedIn

TRANSCRIPT:

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:00:32 – 00:02:35]
Welcome to the we’re the Brits in America Podcast, a Plan first wealth podcast dedicated to helping ambitious expatriates and first generation immigrants thrive in America. I’m your host Richard Taylor and Plan first wealth is the business I founded and run today and we work with successful American and international families living across the US helping them to make the most of their opportunity living and working in America. But first, a quick disclaimer. While Plan First Wealth LLC is an SEC Registered Investment Advisor, the views and opinions expressed in this program are those of the speakers and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions of Plan First Wealth. Information presented is for educational purposes only. Now if you aren’t already receiving our regular emails, please go to our website planfirstwealth.com and sign up there. It’s free and you’ll then be notified every time we drop a new episode and so much more. Okay, let’s get back to this week’s show. Welcome to our Ask an Expert show where I invite a fellow professional in the US UK Cross border space to come in and talk to me about the issues we think Britain America need to be aware of if they are going to thrive here. We are trying something new today folks. This is our first round table. I am delighted to be joined joined by two familiar faces. In the blue corner we have Holly Calder, US UK Tax Advisor and Partner at Buzzercop. And in the red corner we have Aidan Grant, UK US Tax and Trust Estate Planning Attorney, himself a partner at Collier Bristow and basically he’s appeared on this podcast so many times he’s pretty much my co host now I think so essentially because I spend so much time on this podcast pontificating about how every US Connected expat needs a good cross border advisory team. I thought I’d see if I could put one together for a podcast episode. Et voila. So we haven’t done this before and we’re not entirely sure how it’s going to work out, but thank you for coming on this journey with us and I hope it yields some useful information and insights for you that ultimately help you be more successful in America, which is what this is all about. Without further ado, let’s get into this. Hi, Holly and Aidan, welcome back to other Brits in America.

Aidan Grant:
[00:02:35 – 00:02:36]
Hi. Thank you for having us.

Holly Caulder:
[00:02:37 – 00:02:38]
Hi, Richard, thanks for having me again.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:02:38 – 00:03:05]
Yeah, you’re very welcome. You’re very welcome. Last time I did this with you, Holly, we were in person. And last time with Aidan, we were also in person. So it’s good to have you back on the podcast. Thank you very much for coming in. So I tell you what, let’s start by introducing ourselves. I will start, if I may. I am Richard Taylor. I am a cross border financial planner, an investment manager Brit, myself living in America and my firm Plan first wealth, works with British expatriates and others, but mostly British expatriates living across the U.S. holly, what about you?

Holly Caulder:
[00:03:05 – 00:03:19]
I’m Holly Calder and I work at Buzzercott, which is an accounting firm based here in London. And I’m a dual qualified US and UK tax advisor. So a split of Brits in America and Americans here in the uk.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:03:20 – 00:03:21]
Super, Aidan.

Aidan Grant:
[00:03:21 – 00:03:49]
I’m Aidan Grant. I’m a partner here at Collier Bristow. I am a UK tax and estate planning lawyer, or an attorney, as you’d say. In America. I am not US qualified, so unlike Holly, I can’t be giving you qualified U.S. advice. However, most of my clients are American in some form and I’m very used to my providing UK tax advice in a US context. I am also an expatriated American, so for my sins, I have been one of those very many listeners to this podcast who have needed Holly’s advice over the years with my US tax reporting. But an expatriated American now for about the last five and a half years.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:03:50 – 00:05:13]
Excellent. Right, well, listen, if anyone wants more information on these two or more details, go back into our library. Holly was on a while ago and we did UK pensions for British expatriates living in America. What you should be doing, what you’ll be thinking about. And Aiden, just go and listen. Just every other podcast episode we’ve had, Aiden on talking about all things domicile and estate planning and wills and powers of attorney and statutory residence test was our latest one. So loads of good information for you back there, folks in our library. So it’s like a bad joke this, isn’t it? A financial advisor, a tax advisor and an attorney walk into a bar and everyone else leaves. I wanted to put this together because I talk, as I mentioned in the intro, I talk about this all the time. What I think is a need for us connected expats to have a cross border advisory team around them predominantly. And I think, I suspect where we’ll spend most of our time talking about is because of pitfalls, landmines, I call them. Looking at Holly’s email here, she refers to them as traps, which is sure we’ll all agree when anything us connected, there’s just more of them and they’re deeper and thus more expensive to clamber out of. But there’s also, I think tremendous opportunities that can be found as well once you, once you’ve dealt with the landmines, once you’ve, once you’ve cleared the deck, so to speak, there’s, there’s great opportunities from coordinated planning, tax planning, financial planning, etc. So let’s start with what do you think looking at someone who’s already in America or thinking of coming to America, how should someone best prepare or how should someone best structure themselves to, to be a success here?

Holly Caulder:
[00:05:13 – 00:05:42]
Well, I think the first, the first thing we should think about is residents and when that actually starts. I think it’s quite easy for people to book a flight to the US and move there and think that might be their moved or for tax residents purposes, their move date. But it may be that they’ve been spending quite a lot of time there before. Maybe also be that they’re a when does their green card start? So it’s important to actually look at the US residents rules work out when they’re actually going to become tax resident rather than just when they get on that plane.

Aidan Grant:
[00:05:42 – 00:06:45]
I agree and I think in working out when that date is, that is in effect your start date or the end date, your planning really needs to have been concluded. Because a lot of planning when moving between any two countries here we’re talking about say moving to the US is about trying to plan in advance of new tax rules being imposed on you. So let’s say in this case it’s a British citizen moving to the us There may be certain things you are advised to do by Holly or by Richard that will make your life in America easier. But you want to have done that before you become exposed to the US tax system. And it’s going to be the same, largely speaking for when you come to the uk. And so I completely agree with Holly. One of the advantages of that initial residency question is that really gives you your timeline for do I have two months to plan for my arrival in the US or do I have a year and two months and we as advisors would certainly rather they came to us with a year and two months in advance. But we don’t always get to pick our clients and sometimes we have to work with slightly shorter timeframes.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:06:45 – 00:07:08]
Well, here’s a question for you though. So you both started with essentially the value of preplanning. Do people come to you pre departure in your experience, or is it more often, oh, we’re already here and now what? Because in my experience, it’s overwhelmingly we’re already here now what? And I can’t remember which one you said it, but to that, to your point, by that point, a load of options are off the table.

Holly Caulder:
[00:07:09 – 00:07:36]
Yeah, I think the worst cases can be help. I’m trying to do my tax return in the next year and I haven’t, haven’t done it, haven’t spoken to a tax advisor yet. And that we’re already into probably the second year of tax residence, then ideally we’d for US purposes be getting involved the whole calendar year before clients move. But often it ends up kind of being even a few months before is much better than, oh, help, I’ve already been here two years and I haven’t done anything.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:07:36 – 00:08:07]
So, Holly, your experience is someone’s looking to the first tax return. They’ve not come to you before they left, they’ve come to you when they’ve already, when they’re into their second, second year. So for us, historically, we’ve been going nearly 10 years now. It’s always, it’s been people who have been here for a decade or two and are starting to think about retirement that is changing. And I think it’s because of things like podcasts, there’s more information getting out there and we are starting to have people reach out to us beforehand. And I’m really excited about this development. But historically it has been they’re already here and it’s too late.

Aidan Grant:
[00:08:07 – 00:09:32]
I mean, I think one of the things we have to appreciate amongst our respective practice areas here is we spend a lot of time thinking about tax, but most people don’t spend a lot of time thinking about tax. If someone’s thinking of moving to the US there are lots of things on their mind. Their change of jobs, where are the children going to go to school, where are they going to live? And those are going to probably weigh much more heavily on their mind than, gosh, I better make sure I spend to a dual qualified tax advisor before I go. And so certainly for an American coming to the uk, maybe they come in January. Well, that January is possibly 3/4 of the way through a tax year or very commonly you move when the school year starts. So maybe it’s, you know, towards the end of August for someone moving for the US school year, maybe it’s the start of September for the UK school year. But again, if someone comes to me in May and says I’m thinking of moving to the UK in September, from their perspective, they’re thinking, well, it’s great, I’ve got three months till I come to the uk. That’s loads of times to plan. But of course we’re already into the UK tax year in which you’ll go into arrive and so I think it is, I think we have to cut our clients some slack sometimes because what we think is important isn’t necessarily what comes to their mind first in thinking what’s important. Now that’s not to say we can’t and shouldn’t bang the drum for. I completely agree with Collie starting and completing the pre arrival planning in the tax year prior to them coming. But that’s the inevitability of working with a client base which is, you know, very sort of internationally minded and working with two different tax systems that have very different tax year ends, you’re unlikely to move at a time where lines up perfectly in both countries.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:09:32 – 00:10:07]
I have some sympathy as well because the US is different. You know, if you’re moving to Dubai or even Australia or somewhere else, yeah, there’s some planning that should be undertaken. But from what I know, the differences and the, the pitfalls and the, and the potential cost of the pitfalls are nothing like they are when you coming to America or you’re doing something connected to America. There’s one, that it’s not high up on your agenda and two, just your frame of light reference for the repercussions and the need to do planning. I think it’s dramatically different. And when people real as this, often at times it’s too late. But then there are also people who just don’t want to engage in planning and often things get difficult.

Aidan Grant:
[00:10:07 – 00:11:00]
I mean, I think a distinction between the US and the UK as well, particularly in the last maybe six months with the UK tax rules having changed, is the UK has at least some degree of temporary status in the UK which is more tax advantageous if you are coming here for the first time, our foreign income and gain regime, which can last for up to four years and that at least gives some people coming to the UK for the first time a degree of a lighter touch from the UK tax authorities. If you’re coming with, you know, as is usually the case, large overseas wealth. But I defer to Holly here. But I think one of the experiences I have when I have clients going to the US is the US doesn’t really have any kind of try before you buy system. Once you start becoming a tax resident of the US for the first time, you are inside the tax net to its fullest degree. Just as much of someone who was in the US at least on an income tax basis for decades. And so it’s really, really important from a US perspective that you plan in advance then.

Holly Caulder:
[00:11:00 – 00:11:26]
And then we have the additional state complexities as well. Like we’re talking here at federal level, but every state’s got a different set of tax rules. Some of them don’t have income tax, so it’s a bit of an easier one to pre plan for. Some of them have very high state tax like New York and California. Need to think about those as well. They might even have their own set of residence rules. They don’t just follow the federal day counting. There’s sort of different things to think about there too. Yeah.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:11:26 – 00:12:15]
And I was the state thing. Oh man, the state thing is just endlessly complicated and expensive like so I was actually spent a lot of time asking ChatGPT stuff over the other weekend, which incidentally it was incredibly helpful but also got a lot of stuff wrong and I had to keep redirecting it. But essentially I was asking it about if we had an office in New York City because then we’d have a place of business that would lead to taxation there. But not just taxation. New York City has a additional LLC franchise tax L U B T tax. And the way New York counts business done is by presence there. And that’s different to how some of the other states count. Business done, which is where the clients are based is a myriad of complexity. And if you have multiple people in multiple states, the cost of some someone, Holly or someone else to sift through all that and then finally in all these different places really adds up.

Holly Caulder:
[00:12:15 – 00:12:25]
Yeah. And especially ideally we can have a nice clean break to one state. So trying to get ahead of that as well will just help with their compliance burden as well as anything else.

Aidan Grant:
[00:12:25 – 00:13:50]
It is worth thinking about entering into a new tax system, into a new tax regime once you become a US resident. But inevitably because of the mismatch in the tax years, for example, one country is not simply going to relinquish you just because you’ve moved from one country as a resident to the other country as a Resident Holly and I both know that it is quite possible to be resident in both countries at the same time under their respective rules, even if you aren’t a US citizen and so are perennially a US resident for income tax purposes anyway. But if you’re a Brit moving to the US for various UK tax reasons, it can be the case that the UK is going to keep a hold of you for some period of time. And so certainly if you are a British expat living in the US and these rules have changed quite a lot in the last six months. But if you’re a British expat living in the us, you can’t assume that you’ve relinquished all of your fiscal ties to the us even if you don’t actually have any material UK wealth left. And so one of the reasons why your advisory team needs to be joined up not just between tax advisors and attorneys, but also between the US and the UK is that you’re probably exposed to a continuing level of tax in both countries for at least a couple of years. It may well be a lot more than a couple of years. And so any planning that takes place on a pre planning basis in the US or within the first couple of years of being in the US probably also needs to happen with a harmonious UK sort of view of it as well to make sure that you’re not saving US tax only to end up having to pay more UK tax.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:13:50 – 00:14:05]
Should we talk about what some of these pitfalls are now? Regular listen to this podcast will hopefully be familiar with a lot of these, but let’s go there anyway. If someone comes to you before they leave these issues that can be avoided. Or if someone comes to you in that second year or heaven forbid they come to us 10 years in. What are some of these issues that.

Holly Caulder:
[00:14:05 – 00:14:48]
You I think it’s just really important to view your non US assets or foreign assets. So in the UK you might have quite a straightforward set of finances with things like just bank accounts, pensions and investments, but the US will have one a different way of taxing those. And also they have a lot of extra reporting that you need to do. So there can be some really straightforward things that you could do like closing kind of small bank accounts because that means you don’t have to then tell the IRS about it each year. But then it gets more complicated when you thinking about things like structures, trusts and corporations. It doesn’t have to be complicated, there can just be some small things that can you can do ahead of time to smooth your compliance burden.

Aidan Grant:
[00:14:48 – 00:15:53]
I think the error that people make sometimes on its kind of grandest and most theoretical basis, is assuming that because one country does things in a certain way, the other country necessarily does, because we both speak English in different dialects, because we both have a. With common law based jurisdictions, because our tax systems largely at the most fundamental level, operate in similar ways, that therefore the two countries are going to somehow be aligned on a tax basis. And because one country says the word trust, the other country necessarily says the word trust. Because one country uses the word fund, the other country necessarily thinks it’s a fund, or one country thinks it’s a capital gain, the other country thinks it’s a capital gain. I think that’s where a lot of the pitfalls come from. And if we spoke entirely different languages, people might assume or might not assume, I should say the move would be as seamless as it is. But there’s that familiarity trap is probably what catches a lot of people out in assuming that they don’t need to take that advice before they move. Whereas in actual fact, the two tax systems, for all the reasons that Holly mentioned, are in fact sort of significantly different enough that the pitfalls can be really, really quite inconvenient if you don’t.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:15:53 – 00:16:41]
Plan in advance 100%, just mention some of them specifically and work our way up the kind of the food chain, if you like. So start with the most common, which I think Holly alluded to, that is the need for report. So you’ve got non US bank accounts, retirement accounts, investment accounts, anyone who’s moving here in their mid-30s as part of an intercompany transfer, which is what a lot of our clients, and I’m sure your clients do, they’ve got all these things and all these things, assuming you’re above a certain threshold and the thresholds are quite low, they’re going to have to be reported possibly in more than one place. And that takes people completely by surprise because they’ve known how to do it before. And I don’t think you have to do that anywhere else in the world. And not doing so, you can start to rack up pretty significant penalties. This is a trap that on a weekly basis we still see people falling into.

Holly Caulder:
[00:16:41 – 00:16:54]
Yeah. So we just. At the basic level, there’s the, the foreign bank account reports, which there’s no tax coming from that, but all of those little bank accounts, you might have a pound in a post office account that’s got to go on there.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:16:54 – 00:17:04]
But also it’s misleading because it’s called a foreign bank account and it’s not, but it’s not. It’s investment accounts, it’s ISAs, it’s retirement accounts, it’s. It’s anything that’s got cash in it or investments in it.

Holly Caulder:
[00:17:04 – 00:17:28]
Yeah, kind of any financial asset and that. Any kind of monetary financial asset, things like ISIS as well. That’s a common, common trap that you might. That’s got a nice tax free status in the uk, but in the US that’s just an investment account. So that will need to go on there too. So quite normal people can have 10 accounts to go on this form. Makes their filings every year a bit more onerous.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:17:28 – 00:17:45]
Yeah. And then things like, there’s further traps even within this. So it’s like if you have a power of attorney. Right. So if you have a signatory authority over your parents accounts because they’ve become infirm or incapacitated, they have to be included in there. Do business accounts. If you have signature authority over business accounts or is an exclusion for that.

Holly Caulder:
[00:17:45 – 00:17:56]
Yes, there is. The certain business accounts go on different forms in slightly different ways. But if you’ve the very most basic FBAR reporting, if you’ve got signature over the company account that needs to go.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:17:56 – 00:17:58]
On, that needs to go on there as well.

Aidan Grant:
[00:17:58 – 00:17:58]
Wow.

Holly Caulder:
[00:17:58 – 00:18:08]
And that can be quite difficult to obtain. Going to someone in your finance department and asking them for the maximum balance, that’s not going to be a question they’re going to get every day in it for a UK company.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:18:08 – 00:19:05]
So the simple, the kind of bread and butter issue is reporting, I’d say moving up the food chain. The one we see next is Pfix. So for anyone not familiar with this passive foreign investment companies, the US classifies non US collective investments, mutual funds, ETFs, the vast, vast majority are classified as PFICs. If you have pounds or euros or anything in a collective investment, an etf, mutual fund, a unit trust and like whatever we call it, it’s almost certainly a pfic. And this takes it from being a, dare I say, boring, benign, usually investment to something that is punitively taxed and comes with pretty intense reporting requirements. Probably going to cost you a little bit of money with an accountant to do properly. And we see people who have been holding onto Pfix thinking nothing of it for years and years, not realizing the tax burden that’s building. And every year essentially is often in non compliance because they haven’t been filling in these forms.

Holly Caulder:
[00:19:06 – 00:19:18]
Yeah, that’s right. And those forms that have to be filled in as well, there’s no statute of Limitation for those forms. So you might be in here 10 years, but it kind of drag. Could Drag the last 10 years of filings into being incorrect.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:19:18 – 00:20:41]
It’s just kicking you when you’re down, isn’t it? What do they call it? Head trust penalty stacking. I know that’s not what we’re talking about where they just like stack like, oh, you think that’s bad? Here’s something else. Oh yeah, well, by the way, here’s a kicker. Here’s a cherry on top. The real horror with Pfix, we find is ISAs. ISAs. Hopefully everyone listening to podcast is familiar with what an ISA is. It’s an account in the UK that you can contribute to. It grows tax free and you can take the money out tax free. Fantastic account. Most of these are invested in ETFs, mutual funds, and oftentimes I don’t know if you find this, but no one moves to the US thinking they’re doing it forever. I’m sure there are exceptions, but most people in my experience say, you know, we’ll go for two years, three years, four years, we’ll see how we get on. And then we’ll either come back or we’ll stay, you know, and then 20 years later, they’re still here. Well, if you’ve spent 15, 20 years building an ISA and you’ve got tens, hundreds of thousands of pounds in there, you don’t just want to give that up in case you do come back. So people move here with an ISA thinking it’s this tax free account. Great. Not realizing that the US doesn’t recognize an isa, looks right through the wrapper, sees that you’re holding Pfix, and this fantastically tax efficient account becomes the exact opposite of tax efficient, is punitively taxed. And you’ve likely created a reporting issue. Oh, and by the way, maybe a statute limitations issue as well. And that really, when you’re the person who breaks that news to people, it’s. That’s not a fun conversation to have.

Holly Caulder:
[00:20:41 – 00:20:44]
No, we’re never the good guys in those cases.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:20:44 – 00:21:04]
And then we have pensions, retirement accounts. This is more along the lines of reporting requirements. I think if you have a SIP, there’s very likely additional reporting requirements there in a 3520. I don’t know about you, Holly, but we, we regularly see this, people not in compliance with this requirement. And I know then there’s also, if people do have pensions they want to roll over, they can be back to the issues of states. Complications.

Holly Caulder:
[00:21:04 – 00:21:26]
Yeah, it’s important if you’re thinking I mentioned consolidating things before you move, but it’s useful to if you have a US advisor at that point to make sure if you moved five pensions together, what the actual finished pension that you end up with, probably a SIPP is going to look like when you’re in the U.S. so you know the reporting ahead of time and how that’s going to be taxed both at federally and, and at state level.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:21:26 – 00:21:42]
And then Aiden, as we get to the top of that pyramid, I see this less. But, but when I do see this, there’s generally more money involved and the potential for complications and expensive repercussions is significant. The, the T word trusts, these two systems that don’t always play well together.

Aidan Grant:
[00:21:42 – 00:25:31]
Yeah, I mean this is a absolute classic example of a misunderstanding or a miscommunication between two different countries because a lot of times good estate planning will involve trusts. We might use them for tax reasons because we can obtain a particular tax advant, use them for non tax reasons. Maybe we want to shelter assets from a creditor or from a potentially future divorcing spouse. Maybe we want to shelter assets from a small child inheriting too early. And these are all perfectly laudable reasons for putting such trusts in place. But back to the thing you said right back at the very beginning, Richard. The values of having joined up advice is it’s very easy to go to a local domestic estate planning attorney and ask for their regular plan they would advise a high net worth individual to put in place. And that plan might be perfectly suitable for the couple in question. From a US perspective, it might be suitable for them on a global basis. But the problem is the UK tax rules operate quite differently and what might be okay for US purposes might not be okay for UK purposes. And if you have any lingering connection to the uk, maybe you have a UK house, maybe you’ve got UK beneficiaries of your estate, maybe you think one day you’re going to go back to the UK yourself. Assuming that the estate plan is going to work from merely a US perspective is I think potentially short sighted and but for possibly some very small tweaks, maybe while you’re in the period of transition out of the UK tax regime, you could save yourself a lot of headache and heartbreak in the future, particularly for beneficiaries if they have to be dealing with all of these issues at a time when you’re no longer there. I’ll give you one one very very simple example example. Probably the most common estate plan that we would See, structurally speaking, from the US perspective is your classic US pour over will and revocable living trust, very common estate plan, perfectly suited for, you know, many, many different types of estates in the US and that works fine in the us. And you and I, Richard, have talked about why that estate plan could work fine in the us. But the problem is if you have UK assets in the in the estate and the domestic planner in the US creates a worldwide will that encompasses those UK assets inadvertently or revokes a previous UK will because they don’t realize one exists, you can end up with UK assets passing under a US estate plan in a very tax inefficient manner. Maybe that US estate plan is going to have UK beneficiaries eventually and there’s no guarantee that the UK is going to receive and characterize that estate plan in the same tax efficient terms that the US is. So these are all of the sorts of reasons that I try and encourage U.S. attorneys when they’re thinking about estate planning, particularly if that person has just stepped off the plane, you know, in New York or in Los Angeles or you know, in certain name of city here, and they’re thinking about doing some estate planning for a couple that clearly has a UK nexus to them to some degree is to ask em to check should I be thinking about anything UK related here. And if there is a material UK consequence, then the client can think about how much they want to stretch their budget to include those UK consequences or not as the case may be. There are certainly a lot of clients who will say that’s fine, I won’t be here anymore. Maybe it’s a niece or a nephew who’s going to inherit or the values are low. And so I don’t mind these incidental UK consequences, but there will be lots of people that Holly and you richly and I act for who are materially very wealthy. And if when pointed out to them, are you aware that what you’re doing could give rise to possibly some immediate UK inheritance tax consequences or UK capital gains tax consequences that certainly wouldn’t have been on their cards when they went to go and see their domestic US estate planning attorney? So it’s always better, you know, even if we’re not preparing before the clients have arrived, because estate planning tends to work on slightly longer timeframes, it’s always worth getting that sign off from the specialist in the other country just for the piece of mind that nothing you’re doing is going to have an in sort of inadvertent UK tax consequence if.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:25:31 – 00:25:53]
You have done some estate planning for someone, right, And a trust have been set up, a UK trust or a UK trust will be set up on death and then someone connected to that trust, a beneficiary or even a trustee, moves to the us. Do you have to just start completely start again or. I know trust can be based on whether a trustee is resident and what do you do in that situation?

Aidan Grant:
[00:25:53 – 00:27:39]
Really good question. And I extended one step further because of course, someone could be physically in the us, or the beneficiary could be a US citizen living in the uk. Both are US taxpayers to largely the same extent sometimes. So an American is involved, whether they are a citizen or a resident. I mean, I had this exact question from a client about 10 days ago and they said, do I need to basically chuck out my estate plan? And I said, well, no, not necessarily. Because sometimes the tax consequences of having an American involved in the UK estate plan plan can be problematic. But sometimes the tax is incidental to the wider reasons why we’re putting this planning in place. If you’re an American couple living in the UK and you have young American children and you want to shield those American children from inheriting too early, then a trust is a typical and classic way of avoiding doing that. And, you know, yes, a testamentary trust in this case for me, rather than a living trust, ideally. That’s not to say there aren’t tax consequences, but to my mind, the tax consequences ought to rank secondary to the important asset protection qualities for a trust, because the alternative is putting wealth in the hands of young children who can’t benefit from them. The way that I approach that question and I try and provide solutions to families, is to make sure that the estate planning has the requisite flexibility to say we don’t know where these children are going to be, or we don’t know where the eventual beneficiary is going to be. Maybe the child, if both of their parents have sadly died prematurely, the child is going to go back to the States and live with, you know, Grandma and Grandpa, at which point they’re no longer going to be a UK taxpayer and they’re now only going to be US taxpayer. Maybe they’re going to be be in the UK and they’re going to remain dual resident and a double taxpayer. But if we’ve got the flexibility under the estate plan to change that entity of the trustees, change the governing law of the trust, move the powers of the trustees in such a way to best suit the family in the future, then that’s really as much as you can have done as a client to cover your bases. Because life is complicated and full of pitfalls.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:27:39 – 00:27:48]
Kingdon. You can, you can literally set it up so that this is a UK trust right now. But we’re writing in a clause that says we can move this wholesale to America or somewhere else at any point point, and that trust continues.

Aidan Grant:
[00:27:48 – 00:29:42]
From a UK tax perspective, the residency status of a trust is governed by where the trustees are themselves resident. So if you have a wholly UK resident trustee group and all those trustees resign in favor of US trustees, that’s going to export the trust and it’s going to become a foreign trust for UK purposes. Now that’s going to put the trust into a different tax regime. There are consequences for that export and you need to take advice before you do that. But that can put the trust largely outside the scope of UK taxation, depending on what the trust owns as assets. But you have to then marry that up against what the US tax rules are. Because just because you have made the trust foreign from a UK perspective doesn’t mean you’ve made the trust a US domestic trust. I defer to Holly as the US tax advisor, but the trust has to comply with the U.S. court and Control tests which mean the trust in effect being governed by U.S. law and being controlled by U.S. trustees. But if you have the requisite flexibility in the trust to say, for example, this trust that was governed by the laws of England and Wales is now going to be governed by the laws of New York, you have the ability to make decisions in the future to best suit the benefit beneficiaries. Whether an American attorney is as satisfied and content with flexibility is one of the practical limitations we come up against. Because I think American legal practice is to shy away from flexibility. I think because of a fear, I think reasonably founded, that America is a slightly more cautious conservative jurisdiction when it comes to trustee authority and flexibility. They like to bed things in slightly more clearly so there is no room for disagreement. But from my perspective as a UK estate planning lawyer, I like to provide that maximum flexibility so that this isn’t the problem we have to think of now. We give our trustees the best possible tools and in the future those trustees then take that separate advice from a tax advisor like Holly to say, how do we run this trust in the most efficient way possible for a beneficiary class that maybe includes both US and non US beneficiaries.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:29:42 – 00:29:58]
Hey, what’s the worst case scenario? Here is a worst case scenario if you get this wrong. Double taxation without relief or is it it. I’m thinking about living trusts here. When you do one for a domiciled Brit, is it taxation that wouldn’t have existed without you? Get this wrong, what are the repercussions?

Aidan Grant:
[00:29:58 – 00:31:53]
So one thing that Holly and I will both independently be advising clients on quite frequently is about the tax consequences that arise out of trusts. And when you have two different jurisdictions involved, you’re giving both jurisdictions the chance to tax that trust under the terms of their own rules. The US and the UK will often be diametrically opposite in the way they both intended to tax, because it might be that one country views that trust as foreign and the other country reviews that trust as a domestic trust. One country is going to tax the trustees and one country is going to tax the beneficiary. One country is going to tax the trust on a 31 December tax year and one country is going to tax it on a 5 April tax year. And in that scenario you’re exactly right. You can end up with double taxation because each country assumes it’s got the right to tax and it won’t give credit where a different person associated with the trust is going to suffer taxation. So what Holly and I, as a lawyer and a tax advisor will independently do a lot of times is talk to clients about trying to harmonize who the taxpayer is to try and maximize the chance of creating a foreign tax credit. And the ways of doing that will vary depending on the particular type of trust in question. But you are also right that the other worst case scenario, if there can be two different worst case scenarios, is creating a tax charge where one doesn’t even exist in the other countries. So if we have my worst case scenario having a UK expat moving to the US and the day after they move to the US want to set up a revocable living trust that is a nothing consequence in the US because it’s a tax transparent structure. There is a risk that the UK sees that as someone creating a settlement for UK inheritance tax purposes and that could result in an inheritance tax charge on immediately on the creation of that trust at up to 20%. There is no credit in the US to give because it’s not a taxable event in the US but you’ve just created an artificial 20% inheritance tax charge. So yes, either taxes on two different people in both countries or tax on one person where there is no tax in the other country. But in either event you’re resulting in more tax than you thought you were going to have to pay. Which is why you need to take that advice beforehand before you start implementing.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:31:53 – 00:32:59]
It is a very real risk as well, because it’s. That’s kind of like Estate Planning 101 in many states. Here is living. It’s just like the default answer, living trust. And they’ve got no idea whether you’re still UK domiciled, whether that applies. The reason I’ve dwelt on this for a while is I think this issue is going to grow and grow and grow. So I’m sure you’re seeing it. There’s just more money sloshing around now and as a result of that, I think that will result in more trust being created. Elderly people in the UK have more money now and I think they’re more inclined to set up trusts for the benefit of their children. And when one or more of those children may have emigrated to the us, you can end up in a situation where you have US beneficiaries and UK beneficiaries. And kind of another side of that, which we’re seeing here now, is we’re doing more and more estate planning with our clients and they are in America, but they’ve got dual citizen kids and they’re encouraged to set up trusts for kids. I think here is an asset protection thing, honestly, I think it gives people a lot of comfort knowing that a few million is outside of the reach of creditors should something happen, you know, where we live, with the ever present threat of being sued here and then their kids, I think it’s conceivable that there could be beneficiaries on move to the UK at some point, especially the way things are going here.

Aidan Grant:
[00:32:59 – 00:35:00]
Let me give you a really, really typical example, which is, which is where I give theoretical, theoretical advice and then I hand over to Holly as the tax advisor to it, to give the actual practical advice on. One of the things we get asked very frequently by American parents on behalf of maybe a UK resident family is, well, if I leave money the right way into a trust, I can create a trust that is permanently outside the scope of UK inheritance tax. What we refer to in the UK as an excluded property trust. Maybe the parents in the US want to leave $2 million to the child in the UK and I say yes, in theory we can, we can make that so that it has a, you know, 40% saving at the child’s later death. We’ve locked in an $800,000 saving. And an $800,000 saving is not to be sniffed at. But that child in the UK is 30. There’s a long time, actuarially speaking, making for that child to live before we end up with the potential tax saving that you’ve just tried to achieve, maybe even longer if we do the estate planning for the child correctly so they leave their assets to a spouse in a tax compliant manner. How many years has that trust got to run? Bear in mind we may have both US and UK taxpayers bearing in mind Richard, everything I just said to you about the risk of double taxation, how many decades does that trust have to run for before we end up realizing that tax in the future, that’s going to require, require increased tax compliance, that’s going to require tax reporting in both countries in a best case scenario at the highest rate levied between the two countries with a full tax credit. But this is where a firm like Holly’s has to come in and say, well practically speaking this is what the additional cost of running this structure is going to be every year in order to achieve that inheritance tax protection. And so what I end up saying to parents in the US sometimes is yes, in theory what you’re proposing is a good idea, but there may be other ways to achieve that same inheritance tax protection for, through, I don’t know, life insurance, taking out a mortgage, lifetime giving, these kind of things or just spending the money. Because otherwise, and I, you know, I, I mean this with the grace to respect to Holly’s profession. You’re going to spend more time in the company of your tax advisors doing more and more tax returns rather than actually enjoying the money that you were, you know, given in the first place.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:35:00 – 00:36:52]
You have to weigh these things up. So look, as we, I’m going to put you on the spot a little bit, Holly here and, and Aiden. So if nothing springs to mind, don’t worry, we focus, and I think rightly so, go on. The pitfalls, right? The risks, the traps, the landmines as I call them. And I think that’s why everyone needs a cross border team around them to help them navigate this. There’s the risk of penalties. Well first of all, where PVICs are concerned there’s just the risk of getting a massive unpleasant tax bill that could have been completely avoided, which is no one wants. And then there’s also the risk of penalties and, and these, these risks and costs stack up. But there’s also the emotional weight of this and I think that’s always underplayed in people’s, especially if it comes on the back of a regulator or tax compliance outreach. If it’s you realizing there’s a Mistake in fixing it. That’s one way if it’s a letter in the mail from the IRS or hmrc, But I’m thinking irs, that is a whole different ballgame. Partly because you’re then under the microscope and the, the emotional weight from that is massive, but also because a lot of the good options that you have are out the window at that point because they’ve come to you saying there’s a problem rather than you volunteering it. But there’s also so opportunities for us, I think the benefits of working when you work with a financial advisor, a tax advisor and estate planning, that hand in glove, you know, so that you want, that you want them coordinated and communicating. I don’t think it’s good enough to having different professionals. You want a team and a team communicates and collaborates and when you do that, I think there’s lots of opportunities to be taken advantage of as well. The most notable one for us would be Roth planning. Now that’s not unique to cross border. Converting your retirement accounts into Roth accounts, depending on your financial situation can be hugely beneficial, but there can be cross border elements to it. So if, if someone is leav us and going back to the uk, especially depending on what state they’re in, there can be massive arbitrage there, which just completely missed if you’re not aware of this and working with someone. So I wonder, is there anything from your perspective, are there any opportunities that leap out immediately?

Holly Caulder:
[00:36:52 – 00:37:11]
I think having an advisor that knows which questions to ask for you is really helpful. You might be kind of in the middle of the US and the UK advisors and you’re not knowing which questions should be asked. So you don’t want a UK relief to be missed and then the US side not thought sort of or the other way around or just you’re finding those reliefs that work between both countries.

Aidan Grant:
[00:37:12 – 00:38:39]
The nice thing about the US UK community, certainly the USU community from London, but Richard, we adopt you as an overseas brother, is that it’s a very nice and friendly community. Like there’s not that many people that work in this space and Americans, I mean, I joke, Americans are generally nice people to work for and I think that breeds the same harmony inside the professional community. And the advantage of, of being in a joined up sort of profession is, you know, I’ve had the pleasure of knowing Holly for quite a number of years and people in the uk, Richard, that do, you know, financial advisory work, wealth management work, legal work, you know, we all tend to know each other and get on and so I think one of the advantages of having a joined up team is a team that is entirely comfortable with doing precisely the sort of thing that we are doing on this call now, which is getting together, collaborating, sharing ideas. We are not siloed in our respective practice areas. I’m very, very happy explaining what I don’t know. I’m very happy saying, this is not what I advise on. You would be better served going to a tax advisor to ask someone like Holly, because this is a pension taxation question. And I can tell you Holly knows a lot more about pension taxation than I do, even if it’s UK tax advice. And so I have absolutely no qualms or hesitations in picking up the phone to Holly and saying, look, I’ve got this quick question. I think this is probably one more for you. Am I right? Rather than this client being left with this sort of of, you know, eternal question of who is the person that I go to? Because they don’t know, they don’t ask the question. Better to ask the question of someone. And hopefully if you’ve asked the right question of the right person, it shouldn’t be too difficult to put you in touch with who the correct person ultimately should be.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:38:39 – 00:38:48]
Well said. Oh, thank you for adopting me. If I send over a life size cardboard cutout, can you. Will you, will you carry it to events with you and put me in the corner and put a drink in my hand as well?

Aidan Grant:
[00:38:48 – 00:39:51]
It is important to say that we spend, Holly and I spent a lot of time time talking to clients about all the ways in which the taxman wins in these scenarios. You know, in the mishmash of the crossover between US and UK tax, the taxman is inevitably going to win. There are a couple of occasions, and I referenced one earlier in the episode about putting assets into trust and, you know, protecting them from the scope of inheritance tax, where a US parent could do it in a way that a UK parent couldn’t. There are the odd times when there is. I use the same word you do, Richard, arbitrage between the two jurisdictions where the taxman actually, with the taxpayer, sorry, I. I should say actually wins because each country is looking the other direction, assuming the other country is going to be the one levying tax and the taxpayer kind of rides between the two of them when they’re looking in opposite direction. It doesn’t happen that frequently, but if you find a client with the right set of facts, it’s really quite reassuring when you can say to clients, actually, you’ve just avoided paying tax in its Entirety because both countries thought the other one was taxing. And then no one’s paid any tax overall. It doesn’t happen that frequently, but whenever I get a client with the right facts, I like to trumpet it quite hard.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:39:51 – 00:41:08]
Yeah, no, absolutely. When they come along, it’s such a win. You know, so much of what we do is kind of like not a gray area, but it’s like you can’t say we’ve saved you X amount. I mean, Holly probably can attack. It’s more like good financial planning is just cumulative and it’s just, it builds, but it’s not like you can’t put a specific number on it. But sometimes when you encounter a situation like that and you can say because we undertook this planning before you left or whatever or before you arrived, that you can, you can really calculate the impact. And we’ve had a few like that and it’s, it’s very gratifying. I just want to ask you something else, Hayden. I think this is the rise of social media. I think there’s a growing cottage industry selling business structures and trusts as a way to reduce your tax. You know, especially I’m seeing a lot here in the US there’s usually some guy in front of a whiteboard drawing lines between LLC and trust and promising you can pay, pay single figure tax like the billionaire, the secrets billionaires don’t want you to know. That’s usually in there somewhere. And red flags start going off. I’m seeing that more. More or am I encountering people ask for that more and more? And good tax planning, good estate planning, good financial planning is really boring. It’s just doing the right thing year after year for decades and it really builds up. But I’m finding more and more people are looking for these quick wins that I don’t think exist with my legal.

Aidan Grant:
[00:41:08 – 00:44:19]
Hat on rather than my tax hat. And I completely agree with you. And what I sometimes say to clients is at its sort of most fundamental. When a client comes to you with a really random question, my slightly flippant response to clients sometimes is if you think this is so easy, don’t you think the tax authority would have worked it out already? I had a client that came to me about six months ago who said, I want to give my house to my son, but what if I don’t give it to my son? What if I set up a lottery and my son buys the only lottery ticket and I auction off my house at the lowest possible at the quickest, earnest possible opportunity? Well, lo and behold, my son’s bought a £1 raffle ticket and he’s just won the raffle or the lottery or whatever it is. I’ve just sold it to him for a pound. And it wasn’t, you know, I said no. Number one, I think you’re operating an unregulated gambling arrangement and I’m not a gambling lawyer, but I’m fairly certain what you’ve done is illegal anyway. But more’s the point, no HMRC know exactly what you’ve done. You are not the first person to think of this. If it seems too good to be true, it probably is. If you’re paying someone a lot of money for this really fragile structure that seems to work in this exact way you’ve been planned, it might work, you might find it works. Or you might find yourself as one of those celebrities who you see trumpeted around every couple of years who have been burned by the taxman because it turns out they’d given a lot of money to an advisor who’d invested in a way that they weren’t aware of, and it turns out they’ve got to pay lots of extra tax. I’m not going to name any of the celebrities, but we probably know the ones we’re thinking of. The way I increasingly these days talk to clients about their tax planning and their estate planning is how much do we want the tax tale to wag the dog? How much is an easy life important to you? We can talk about ways in which we skirt the line between tax avoidance and tax evasion. Is it tax mitigation? Is it tax harmonization? If we take this approach, to what extent is HMRC going to come after you or are they not? Because exactly, as you said, some of these areas are gray areas. You also have to live with the consequences of those decisions. And how much do you want to spend. Spend the next 10 years of your life looking over your shoulder because either HMRC or the IRS are going to come after you. It might not be you they come after, it might be your kids they come after. Because maybe this is estate planning and it’s going to be at your death where your children have to deal with this. At the times in your life when actually, you know, harmony in your family is probably most important because of, you know, dealing with grief or dealing with important family events. That’s not a time when you want to chuck HMRC or the IRS into the mix as well. There is more time life than tax, despite the fact that we all spend our life talking about it. Sometimes I present to clients the option is not the most tax efficient, but it’s the simplest or it’s the most convenient, or it’s the just most base level. And the clients sometimes say, yeah, that’s what I want. I know it’s not the most tax efficient, but that’s the way that leads me to the easy path and I don’t mind paying a little bit more tax if it is just simple and done and understood and uncontroversial. That’s enough for me. And then in the future, if we want to talk about more complex estate planning or more complex tax tax planning, then we will. But I try not to assume that what someone wants is the hyper complicated Jersey, Guernsey, Liechtenstein, Foundation, Cell Trust, LP structure which results in them paying a marginal additional rate of 5% less tax and then spend the next 20 years for the taxman to chase after them. It seems increasingly baffling in today’s joined.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:44:19 – 00:44:29]
Up world, but I think people are more willing to skirt the line until they’re under the microscope, in which case, I don’t know, people realize just what an awful place that is is to be.

Aidan Grant:
[00:44:29 – 00:45:19]
Our job is to present the options and our job is to say here are three different ways that this planning could be undertaken, or here are three different ways of achieving your objective. There are some advantages and there are some disadvantages. Maybe option A is the most tax efficient on paper, but it will require more reporting. Maybe B will take the longest to come to bear and so you’ve got a greater degree of uncertainty. Maybe option C relies on a third party playing along with your, with your plan. These are all perfectly good options. You have to make a commercial judgment as to which one is right for you ethically. My role as a lawyer is to present the options that I think are in the client’s best interests and then they decide what is best amongst them. It’s never in my client’s best interest to present some option that is shady or somehow complicated from a revenue regulatory perspective. That’s just not me acting as an advisor. My job is to advise my clients and I’m going to advise them accordingly.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:45:19 – 00:45:57]
As people selling schemes memes. That’s what we’re seeing. That’s just all out there on social media. It’s, and it’s a growing problem I think, in the UK as well as the us. All right, so as we wrap up here, what is our message to current and especially budding US expatriates other than don’t try and come on an H1B visa, which for anyone listening that debacle is blowed up this weekend. So I would say our message is to the extent that you can invest in pre planning, it will have a cost, but it I believe it will pay dividends in landmines avoided and hope, maybe even some future planning. And I’m going to say it, engage a cross border team right from the outset. Do you anything to add?

Aidan Grant:
[00:45:57 – 00:46:45]
I would say you might think it’s slightly ironic, but it gives me no greater pleasure sometimes than someone comes to me and says I was really concerned. Can I just check, is my fact pattern something where I need to be concerned about the UK legal or tax consequences? And I turn to Anthem and I say, you know what, actually no, you’re really not a UK taxpayer anymore or your structure really has no UK nexus anymore. I’m really grateful for you reaching out and it gives me no greater pleasure than to share a couple of emails with you to say, no, probably not. Or maybe not unless the following things happen. It doesn’t happen that frequently because of the overlap between the two countries. But it is always better to ask and be accused of being too cautious than to not ask for fear that you’re going to find an answer that you don’t like. Because if you stick your head in the sand, the revenue can still find you there. So it is always, always better to ask.

Holly Caulder:
[00:46:45 – 00:47:07]
Yeah, I think especially with the residence planning, it might be that we just do some straightforward residence advice and agree a maximum number of days you can spend in the US each year and delay your US residents. So that’ll prevent, you know, the whole pre planning thing. It just might mean we can then push, push the US residence further down. But you know, you’re fully confident that you haven’t accidentally picked up that residence before you planned it.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:47:07 – 00:47:12]
All right, guys, well, I think we’ve done it. Unless you have anything else to add, then we’ll leave it there. Where can people find find you?

Holly Caulder:
[00:47:13 – 00:47:18]
Look me up on our Bazacot website to look for Holly Calder or find me on LinkedIn.

Aidan Grant:
[00:47:18 – 00:47:27]
I am also Summer on LinkedIn and similarly I’m fairly certain it’s Collier bristow.com and you can find Aidan Grant. They’re happy to take any questions.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:47:27 – 00:47:29]
Aiden, let’s plug your own podcast while we’re at it.

Aidan Grant:
[00:47:29 – 00:47:41]
You have US UK Tax Talk at time of recording. Holly was kind enough to come on a couple of years ago. Richard, at time of recording you have bitcon as a guest, but it has not yet been published. But by the time this gets published, I suspect you’re probably will have been super.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:47:41 – 00:47:46]
Go check it out folks. All right, well, thank you both for this conversation and I shall see you soon.

Aidan Grant:
[00:47:46 – 00:47:47]
Thanks Richard.

Holly Caulder:
[00:47:47 – 00:47:47]
Thank you.

Richard Taylor, Founder of Plan First Wealth:
[00:47:49 – 00:49:07]
All right folks, that’s another episode of we’re the Brits in America Under Our Belts. Thank you for listening. I appreciate it and I appreciate you. If you’re enjoying the show and would like to support the mission, which is to help ambitious expats and immigrants thrive in America, I’d ask you to subscribe to the POD wherever you listen and also also consider leaving a rating and review. This stuff really does matter. Please help us get this information to the people who need it, I. E. Your fellow expats. Just a quick reminder that this show is brought to you by Plan First Wealth. We are a US Based lifestyle financial planner and wealth Manager and we help successful American and international families living across the US to make the most of their opportunity and ultimately to retire happier. If you’d like to know more about how we might be able to help help you, you can find us on our website, www.planfirst wealth.com or you can look me up on LinkedIn. Do get in touch. We’d love to hear from you. As always, thank you to the podcast guys for their help producing this episode and the entire show. See you next time. Sam.