Episode 88
Portugal for American Expats: Golden Visas, Tax Traps and Big Rule Changes
Portugal has become one of the most popular destinations for Americans moving abroad, but the move is not always as simple as it looks. From visas and tax residency to Golden Visa funds, PFIC reporting, retirement accounts and recent citizenship changes, there are plenty of details that can catch Americans out if they do not plan properly.
Richard Taylor – dual UK/US citizen and Chartered Financial Planner – is joined by Zeev Fisher – an international advisor and founder of Fresh Legal Group – a boutique firm specialising in international wealth and cross-border tax. Together, they unpack what Americans need to know before moving to Portugal, especially those navigating US tax, expat tax advice, and complex cross-border rules.
They break down the key visa routes for Americans, including the D7 passive income visa and the D8 digital nomad visa, and when a Golden Visa makes sense. They also explain how PFIC rules can create unexpected US tax issues, why using retirement funds for a Golden Visa investment can trigger serious penalties if done incorrectly, and how these decisions fit into broader cross border financial planning.
Richard and Zeev also discuss Portugal’s new tax regime replacing the former non-habitual resident system, and what it means in practice for Americans moving over today. Finally, they break down the recent citizenship rule changes and why they have become such a major issue for current and future expats, particularly those thinking long term about expat retirement planning or building a life overseas.
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Expat Wealth is supported by Plan First Wealth. Plan First Wealth is a Registered Investment Advisor serving fellow expatriates and immigrants living across the US on matters such as retirement planning, investment management, tax planning and non-US asset management.
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Expat Wealth is affiliated with Plan First Wealth LLC, an SEC registered investment advisor. The views and opinions expressed in this program are those of the speakers and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions of Plan First Wealth.
Information presented is for educational purposes only and does not intend to make an offer or solicitation for the sale or purchase of any specific securities, investments, or investment strategies. Investments involve risk and unless otherwise stated, are not guaranteed. Be sure to first consult with a qualified financial adviser and/or tax professional before implementing any strategy discussed herein. Plan First Wealth does not provide any tax and/or legal advice and strongly recommends that listeners seek their own advice in these areas.
ABOUT RICHARD:
Richard Taylor is a British expat, dual citizen (UK & US). Originally from Bolton, he now lives in Greenwich, CT, where Plan First Wealth has its head office.
As the firm’s leader, Richard launched Taylor & Taylor, now Plan First Wealth, and continues to fuel the firm’s growth. Richard is a Chartered Financial Planner (UK – CII) in addition to holding the IMC (CFA UK) and Series 65 (US – FINRA).
Connect with Richard on LinkedIn
TRANSCRIPT:
Richard Taylor:
[00:00:00 – 00:00:11]
I’ve been watching as Portugal has just like, it’s just gone stratospheric. It’s come from being on no one’s radar really to like it seems everyone’s moving there and lots and lots from America.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:00:11 – 00:00:21]
Well, first of all, it’s a great place to live. The visas are simpler, the taxes are simpler. So you don’t have wealth taxes in Portugal, you don’t have inheritance tax in Portugal.
Richard Taylor:
[00:00:21 – 00:00:32]
Trading from America, it’s just a whole different ball game. But to try and emigrate from America, solo diying, it is an act of pure madness, in my opinion.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:00:32 – 00:00:40]
I think a lot of people, they don’t appreciate the cultural difference. It’s huge. It’s a completely different culture and, and you just, you have to, you have to embrace it.
Richard Taylor:
[00:00:42 – 00:02:18]
Welcome to Expat Wealth, a Plan first wealth podcast dedicated to helping ambitious expatriates in America and Americans overseas thrive. I’m your host, Richard Taylor and Plan first wealth is the business I founded and run today. And we work with successful expatriates and immigrants and internationally minded Americans to make the most of their opportunity and avoid the expat landmines. First, a quick disclaimer. While Plan First Wealth LLC is an SEC registered investment advisor, the views and opinions expressed in this program are those of the speakers and do not necessarily reflect the views and positions of Plan First Wealth. Information presented is for educational purposes only. Now, if you aren’t already receiving our emails, please go to our website, www.planfirstwealth.com and sign up there. It’s free and you’ll be notified every time we drop a new episode. And so much more. Okay, let’s get back to this week’s show. Welcome to An Ask an expert show from Expat Wealth. My guest today is Zev Fisher. Zev is the founder of Fresh Legal Group, a boutique international tax specialized firm operating in Portugal and supporting expats, especially American expats in their move to Portugal with taxes, immigration and investments. And that is exactly what we are here to talk about today. Portugal has exploded in popularity for Americans in recent years and we’re going to to investigate why that is the case, how Americans can make the move, what they need to be aware of and what landmines they need to avoid and some of the recent significant changes and what they mean for current and future expats. So without further ado. Hi Zev, welcome to Expat Wealth.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:02:18 – 00:02:22]
Hi Richard, pleasure to be here. Looking forward to for this conversation today.
Richard Taylor:
[00:02:22 – 00:02:49]
Yes, likewise, likewise. As I said, I’ve been Watching as Portugal has just, like. It’s just gone stratospheric. It’s come from being on no one’s radar, really, to, like, it seems everyone’s moving there and lots and lots of America, and I’ve had clients move there. I’ve had more and more conversations about it. So I’m really keen to get into this today. But before we do that, can you just tell everyone a little potted history of you and your firm?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:02:49 – 00:03:22]
Sure, yeah. So I’m personally not Portuguese. I’m Israeli and British, actually. And I found myself in Portugal during the pandemic and was stuck. So there was the alpha variant at some point, if you remember, and I ended up getting stuck in Madera, and I was doing tax law before, and I was trying to get tax advice from my own situation, and I didn’t feel that I found what I was looking for, and I ended up setting up a firm.
Richard Taylor:
[00:03:22 – 00:03:24]
Wait, do you mean you were on vacation?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:03:24 – 00:03:25]
I was on vacation, yeah.
Richard Taylor:
[00:03:26 – 00:03:33]
And because of COVID you got trapped in Madeira and that set you on a path that resulted in the establishment of your firm?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:03:34 – 00:03:55]
Yeah, yeah, exactly. And it’s not that unusual a story for people who have been stuck in Portugal. A lot of people have been stuck in Portugal at the time, and it’s a nice place to be stuck in. So we weren’t that keen to go back. And by the time the. So this third lockdown, I think it was subsided, we were quite sold on staying in Portugal.
Richard Taylor:
[00:03:55 – 00:04:04]
That’s a brilliant story, as both that you ended up moving there and a whole business has grown out of that.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:04:04 – 00:06:31]
Well, I tell people that I’m like a child in a candy shop in Portugal because there’s so much to do here. And I think sometimes a lot of the Portuguese are missing out on how much room for growth and innovation and doing things there is. And a lot of young Portuguese people actually leave Portugal and they see a completely different picture than what we see when we come in. It’s a beautiful country, it doesn’t have a very good job market, and that’s why young people leave. But if you’re an entrepreneur and you want to create things, it’s because it’s kind of like, in a nice way, it’s kind of behind on many things. It’s kind of of like nostalgic 20 or 30 years ago in some ways. A lot of the things we’re used to in other countries, they don’t yet work the same way in Portugal or they don’t yet exist in Portugal. So Yeah, and just in my specific case, a modern tax firm which sort of grown to be a full service firm for expats was what I was doing before with a different hat. But it’s true on other aspects as well. So if you want to set up a business, and this is something we’re encouraging people to do and we’re trying to help them as well. But if you want to set up a business and create something, Portugal is a lovely place to do it. It’s not just a great place for lifestyle, which it is. The weather’s great, the beaches are great, the food is great, a lot of very nice people. But beyond a really nice place to live, it’s a really great place to set up a company, to create things to build. And this is what I’m focusing on now because we’ve spent the first. I’ve set up this firm just four and a half years ago or so. We’re now 16 lawyers and two accountants. So we’ve grown quite a bit in that time. But now we’re trying to help clients that are coming to Portugal create and build in Portugal as well, not just move. So yeah, as I said, looking forward to this discussion, but it’s an expat firm because I’m an expat myself. So I have, I am qualified as a lawyer in addition to the uk, also in Portugal, and I’m also an enrolled agent in the us So I have the relevant background to do expat work. But I also really like the. I really sympathize with the story because it’s my story too.
Richard Taylor:
[00:06:31 – 00:07:13]
Yeah, that’s really cool. I hadn’t actually. I’ve only thought about this from a semi retirement retirement angle. Maybe I’m guilty of labeling Europe the way, I don’t know, the way it unfairly gets labeled, sometimes bureaucratic sleepy. But to hear that it’s that your experience, actual lived experience, building a company from scratch has been radically different. And now you take. That’s quite exciting actually. So, but before we do that, tell me about freshly. Because it’s ostensibly tax, but it’s morphing to much more than that. And it’s a one stop shopping on many levels and I think people are crying out for that. So just give us a brief intro to the company you have founded.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:07:14 – 00:07:34]
Sure. Yeah. So it was me and another tax lawyer when we started because tax is the. This is my practice area and it’s the core and where we saw the biggest need was cross border tax. So you know, someone who understands both sides of the move. So yeah, very strong American client base, also British and now many other nationalities.
Richard Taylor:
[00:07:34 – 00:07:39]
Did it start originally like mainly British and then over time as morphed American or did you start straight away focusing on Americans?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:07:40 – 00:08:15]
Americans were always the biggest, our biggest market. You know, the Brits have always been in Portugal and they’re mainly in the Algarve and their mail. I mean this is changing too now. Right. But it used to be people, people from the UK going to retire in the Algarve and they don’t really need that much tax advice. So you need more tax advice when you’re coming in with a business that needs restructuring, when you have kind of more more complicated investments and things like that. These are the sort of people that typically look for tax advice if you just have.
Richard Taylor:
[00:08:15 – 00:08:46]
And when you’re anything connected to America, expatriating from any other country than America is 100 times easier and less landmines. And expatriating from America where with citizenship based taxation and factor and everything that follows from that, it’s just a whole different ball game. And to do, to try and it is to try and emigrate. I suspect you see this, I don’t really see this. But to try and emigrate from America solo diying is, is an act of pure madness in my opinion.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:08:46 – 00:09:24]
Yeah, it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s. Well yeah, I mean if, if you have anything other than just say Social Security then it gets like super complicated and you still need to two people to file taxes even if you only have Social Security. So. And yeah, it gets the. The US has its own corporate structures, US llc. It’s not something that exists in other places. It seems obvious to Americans, but it’s not the same entity as. It’s nothing like a European company. It’s completely different things like a Roth or 401ks and retirement accounts in the US are completely different than in Europe.
Richard Taylor:
[00:09:24 – 00:10:03]
Every American with means has a revocable trust and not literally everyone, but the vast majority, a lot. I don’t know if that causes problems in Portugal, but it certainly does in France and other places. And people. This doesn’t even occur to people because it’s just so it’s like financial planning, legal tax 101 in America, you know, and they, they, they don’t think I’ve moved and not thought about stuff that I have later thought about and thought oh, you know, I should have given that some thought. Yeah. So. So anyway, I’ll get, I’ll get off my, my high horse. I get off My soapbox. So tell us from your perspective, why. Why is. Why. Why has popular Portugal just exploded? Is it. Is it pure lifestyle? Is it because of ease of movement there? All the above. What’s going on?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:10:03 – 00:12:49]
All the above, yeah. Well, first of all, it’s a great place to live, and it’s just a really nice country and it has everything going for it. Generally get in Southern Europe, so, you know, the great weather and the relaxed culture and great beaches. But okay, I mean, arguably you get those in Spain and in Italy as well. But it’s easier to move. So the visas are simpler, the taxes are simpler. So you don’t have wealth taxes in Portugal. You don’t have inheritance tax in Portugal. But maybe even more important than the actual system, which is easier than the Spanish or Italian one, the authorities are more relaxed. So in Spain, the authorities are notorious for chasing people. They’re very, very aggressive. And if you don’t want to go to a South European country and enjoy a relaxed lifestyle and have tax investigations. So it’s not like you can’t get them in Portugal, but it’s not notorious for being vicious. If you make mistakes, you pay for them. But if you’re kind of reasonable and you don’t make mistakes and you get good advice, you would normally be left to your own devices and wouldn’t be bothered too much. It’s the English level. So the most you can get by in Portugal with English, at least on sort of a superficial level, it helps to speak Portuguese, but it’s not. Again, it’s unlike in the other Spain or Italy or Greece, when it’s really impossible to get by without the local language, and it’s a softer, I think, less imposing culture. So the Portuguese, they’re very proud of their culture and they want people to be respectful, but they don’t want you to be Portuguese in the same way that other cultures are sort of imposing and they say, oh, you need to behave like us. The Portuguese are more subtle or modest in that they want you to respect them, but they’re fine with foreigners as long as the foreigners are respectful of the culture, are trying to be nice and helpful and not rude, and are patient, and that this is enough, you can have a good life without being fully integrated into the local culture. So it’s softer in a way to come to Portugal, and it’s easier from a legal perspective and it’s less intrusive from a tax perspective. It’s closer geographically. So you kind of combine all of those things and you end up with quite a Lot going for it. And I think that these are the reasons people are going to Spain and Italy as well, and Greece. But I’m sold on Portugal. I think it’s the best one.
Richard Taylor:
[00:12:49 – 00:12:57]
How are you finding Americans a year later, two years later, are you finding people? Are they settling in well, acclimatizing well?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:12:57 – 00:14:09]
Yeah, it depends. Some do, some don’t. I think it really depends on whether people manage to do the cultural adjustment. I think a lot of people, they don’t appreciate the cultural difference. It’s huge. It’s a completely different. I mean, there’s always a cultural difference when you move to another country, but this in Portugal or generally in Southern Europe, it’s a completely different culture and you have to embrace it. And I personally love it. But I think for some people, it’s tough for everyone at times, especially if you need something to be done quickly and things can take a very long time and sometimes make no sense. So if you’re coming with, with this mindset that you expect things to work in the same way they have in the US or in the UK or wherever it is that you come from, and I think the worst thing is that you go somewhere, say the immigration office or the tax office, and you expect things to work in a certain way and what you want to happen doesn’t happen. If you get aggressive in Portugal, which is something that sometimes Americans do.
Richard Taylor:
[00:14:10 – 00:14:11]
Let me speak to your manager.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:14:11 – 00:14:24]
I need to speak to the manager. Yeah, if. If you go like, you know, why are you. Why? You know. Yeah, exactly. That it will lead to the exact opposite outcome of what you’re hoping or expecting.
Richard Taylor:
[00:14:24 – 00:14:26]
They’ll just shut down and like, and.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:14:26 – 00:14:49]
Like, they will just shut down and they will torture you on purpose if they don’t like you. And, you know, there’s nothing stopping them from doing that. And there’s no, you can’t. You can’t complain. It’s. It’s unacceptable in Portuguese culture to complain. People don’t complain. So if you complain, they will punish you for that. So you really have to be very patient.
Richard Taylor:
[00:14:49 – 00:15:10]
Well, this is super interesting, Sev. So there’s two sorts of complaining. There’s the British complaining, which is done not to officials, but to each other behind people’s backs. That’s not what we’re talking about here. We’re talking about the American style complaining, which is complaining about service or lack of speed and demanding to speak to the manager. Two very different sorts of complaining, One of which is going to get you in serious trouble in Portugal.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:15:11 – 00:16:59]
Yeah. I mean, we have the odd Brits that feel somewhat entitled. I mean, I’m sure you know the type, but, you know, people ask me about. About that a lot. The absolute, vast majority of Americans that are coming here are absolutely lovely people. I mean, you can’t. You know, you have not so nice people in every culture, and I think sometimes Americans, they feel kind of apologetic. But, I don’t know, you can go to Albufeira and see all the old drunk Brits that are celebrating, and you can have a very different experience. But the vast majority of Americans are very nice, respectful. I really like working with them. They get along really well. You have the odd person that thinks that they deserve something. And these people, they don’t last in Portugal because the culture just doesn’t accept that. If you start making demands, you want to see the manager, you want to complain you’re unhappy, you can go back to your country, as the saying now goes. But if you’re nice to people and you are polite and you build relationships over time and you know where to go, you will get well beyond what you’re strictly supposed to. So it goes both ways. You know, you could have a very sad outcome, or, you know, you could definitely not receive the outcome that you’re supposed to receive in a particular place, even though the rules say you should, you should get it. But it also goes the other way around. If you know who to talk to, if you’re nice to people, if they like you, if you like them, if you’re polite and patient, you can solve a lot of problems just because you know you know someone or even you don’t know someone is just very, very polite.
Richard Taylor:
[00:17:00 – 00:18:20]
Love that. That whole thing about the expecting the culture to be the same, that is. That’s universal. I think one of the problems moving Brits moving to America is we fall into a trap thinking it’s the same culture of ours, because we grew up on their movies and we speak the same language, and it’s radically different. And it’s. I’m. I’m over 10 years in now, and it took me a long time of letting go of my expectations. I think it should be this way. And sometimes you later come to realize that the way you thought it should be done, it actually was not the. Was a. Was an inferior way. So that’s kind of humbling as well. Yeah. I tell you what, you’re making me like the. You’re making me like the Portuguese. More and more with this conversation, I will also say, well, I love working with expats, because in my Experience expats, people who have like left their country, who have like, who have the, you know, the balls to do that. Right. Who are they tend to be open minded, adventurous, bold, good, Pete, fun people. And I’m sure that that’s certainly the same with the Americans. I think, I think that’s, I think that’s an attribute of expats globally. So I can imagine the sort of people that are looking to do this. The, the respectful, open minded, ply. All the good, all the good attributes I’ve come to associate with people who expatriate and even those who are looking to expatriate. Right. So Zev, how I’m an American in America. This is, sounds very appealing to me. How do I, how do I move to Portugal?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:18:21 – 00:18:36]
It’s very easy. So you have a lot of visas actually that you can apply for, assuming you’re not European. Right. I mean if you’re a European citizen, you have a European passport of one or your partner has European passport. Very easy.
Richard Taylor:
[00:18:36 – 00:18:54]
I did, I don’t need to rub salt in the wounds. I did have a European passport. I’ve just renewed my old burgundy European passport and it is now blue. And I do no longer have the right to live in Europe. So I am an American and a Brit and I do not have a European passport, but hopefully many of our many Americans do.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:18:54 – 00:19:56]
So in the absence of European passport, there are a few visas that are very popular. I think the most popular one is a D7. A D7 is a passive income visa. You need to roughly make the minimum salary in Portugal, which is very low, and have some savings and that’s it really. No criminal record. So if you have passive income, that rises to the level of the minimum salary in Portugal, which is about €1,000, it’s a little under €1,000 and you have some savings, you can apply for a D7 visa. It’s straightforward, it’s not a difficult application. It doesn’t take very long to receive an answer. It’s usually within two or three months. You receive the initial answer and then you need to convert the visa into a residence permit and you get it for a couple of years, you renew and that’s it. I mean, if you have passive income, you use that visa.
Richard Taylor:
[00:19:56 – 00:19:57]
What counts as passive income?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:19:59 – 00:22:47]
Dividends, interest, capital gains, in some cases profits from a business. That depends on how things are presented. So if you have a company that you own and you receive dividends, that sort of borderline between active and passive, it depends on how it’s presented. Sometimes different consulates behave in a slightly different way, but you’re generally not hard and, well, not hard if you’re coming from the U.S. some consulates are very. If you’re in Bangladesh, for example, it’d be very hard to get a D7 visa. I mean, it’s supposed to be the same rules, but it’s not, it’s not applied in the same way. And this is something that you see all around Portugal. Same point on culture. Every place you go to Portugal to deal with authorities, you will get a different outcome. So you need to know where to go. But generally visas are straightforward. So it’s not hard for Americans to move to Portugal if you’re a remote worker. So if you don’t have passive income, but you’re a remote worker and you intend to keep working remotely, you have a D8 visa, which is the digital nomad visa. I think it stands at about €3,500, something like that right now, which you need to have as monthly income. A lot of Americans have that. And unlike both of these visas, unlike their Spanish and Italian equivalents, once you’ve received the visa and you’re in Portugal, you are allowed to work. So for example, if you move to Spain on a non lucrative visa, which is the D7 equivalent, you’re not allowed to work ever. Same thing in Italy. In Portugal you can work no problem. You just need to show that you have the passive income. There is a D3 visa, highly qualified professionals. If you have a job offer from a Portuguese company and then you need to make about 16, €1700amonth, something like that, it’s not much. And if you have a job offer, you can move on the basis of that job offer. We use these visa a lot when we have people that have a problem applying in their consulate because you can apply from within Portugal. So we have now people trying to get out of Dubai and at the time we had Russians and Ukrainians, so both sides that couldn’t apply in the consulate, so they applied for a D3 visa. And of course you have the golden visa, which if you have half a million to invest. The nice thing about the golden visa, or maybe the only benefit of the golden visa over the others is that you don’t actually have to live in Portugal. So you know, to the question of how do you move to Portugal? I mean definitely you don’t need the golden visa for that.
Richard Taylor:
[00:22:47 – 00:23:10]
You just answered a question that was on, like what? Because I do want to get into this golden visa question because I know it’s a hot topic And I was wondering, if these others are so easy, why would anyone do the golden visa? And you’ve just answered it, which is, you don’t have to live there. Then my next question for you is, why would anyone, why would people take a golden. Why would people invest $500,000 in a golden visa to not live in Portugal?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:23:11 – 00:23:26]
For two reasons. First, to have the ability to come and go whenever they please without thinking of Schengen restrictions. So if you come in, you need to pay attention, not to overstay. With a golden visa, you don’t have these restrictions. You can come and go whenever you please.
Richard Taylor:
[00:23:26 – 00:23:29]
Only to Portugal though, right? Not the rest of the Schengen area.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:23:29 – 00:25:03]
Once you have a golden visa, your Portugal time is not counted towards the 90 day restriction. So you can be like 90 days in all the rest of the Schengen plus as much as you want in Portugal. And also if you come into Portugal and you move to another Schengen country, there are no borders. So in reality you can kind of move. You can’t move to France, but you can kind of travel freely and without many restrictions. And there’s obviously a lot of people applied for golden visa in order to try and get citizenship or permanent residency. And now the citizenship timeline is changing, but the permanent residency timeline is not changing. And Portugal is still the only country in Europe, as far as I know, where you don’t have to live in Portugal, but you can still get permanent residency after five years. So even if the citizenship is changing, the permanent residency is not. So it’s a long, long term option. Kind of long term. Plan B, play for people that don’t want to move now, because people that want to move now, they don’t need this. But people that don’t want to move now or they want to move, but they don’t want to restrict themselves to spending most of their time in Portugal. Maybe they want to, you know, travel around. We have people that have like a child in the US and a child in Canada, and they want to spend three months here, three months there, and the rest of the time in Portugal. And so they can’t do that on the other visas.
Richard Taylor:
[00:25:03 – 00:25:07]
Why do they have a minimum, A minimum residence per year?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:25:07 – 00:25:30]
Yeah, there is a minimum. So you have to be average eight months a year and at least six months a year in every given year if you are on a normal residency visa. So you don’t have these restrictions with a golden visa. But that’s the only reason. It’s, it’s, you know, otherwise it’s it takes longer, it’s more expensive, it, so it doesn’t make sense unless you want that flexibility.
Richard Taylor:
[00:25:34 – 00:25:51]
Right, well, can we then drill down onto this? Because I know these golden visas, the way these investments can be structured can cause some problems that are unique to Americans and they catch a lot of Americans out because they don’t not aware of these issues. So can we, can we like drill down into that a little bit, please?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:25:52 – 00:26:12]
Sure. I, I, I, I wouldn’t always use the word problems. It’s just awareness. Any, any foreign investment in funds for. So the golden visas are mainly, it’s mainly funds now. It used to be real estate or funds, but then when it used to be real estate or, or funds, almost everyone did real estate and now it’s real estate’s gone. So everyone does funds.
Richard Taylor:
[00:26:12 – 00:26:17]
Just, just to confirm what you mean by funds, you mean like a mutual fund style arrangement?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:26:17 – 00:27:38]
It’s like a mutual fund. Yeah, it’s usually closed funds, so it can be either open or closed. But most of the Golden Visa funds are closed funds. So you invest in half a million euros in a fund. At least 60% of that needs to be invested in Portugal. So not 100% but at least 60% needs to be invested in Portugal. Some funds are doing vanilla securities, some funds are doing private equity. And then you have a lot of specialist funds. You have funds doing old cars or football teams and you really have a large selection of investment products. But the mutual thing is that it needs to be half a million in a fund that is regulated by the Portuguese equivalent of the sec. It’s called cmbm. And a foreign fund is a PFIC from a US perspective. So it’s a structure that has specific reporting requirements and specific taxation in the US So you need the fund to provide certain paperwork, you need to have some cash flow issues you need to be aware of and you need the CPA that knows how to file a tax return for a pfic. So if you do everything right, it’s, yeah, it’s fine, it’s not the end of the world. But if you make mistakes like anything else with US taxes, it can be costly.
Richard Taylor:
[00:27:38 – 00:27:51]
So are you saying that Americans can invest in a Golden Visa in a PIFC structure and if it’s handled correctly from the get go, it’s not wildly tax inefficient?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:27:52 – 00:29:15]
No, it’s not. I mean, so the only downside is that it’s slightly cash flow tricky. So the way it works is that if you invest in a pfic, you have. Sorry, if it Gets a little bit technical, but I think that that’s what you wanted to talk about. So on the first year of your investment, you need to make an election called the QEF election. You can basically say, I want this investment to be treated in a more tax preferential way. And the idea of QAF elections is that you still get for dividends, you still get dividend taxation for capital gains, you still get capital gains tax taxation. So you get the right tax for each one of your investments. But whether you need to be paid tax on the profits of the fund, whether they are distributed or not. So there’s a notional distribution, not twice. I mean you only pay tax once, but there is a notional distribution whether the fund distributes or whether it doesn’t. So if you invested half a million in the fund aggregates and it doesn’t distribute, but it has profits, then you still need to pay tax on the profits every year. So you just need to factor it into your investment that either you invest in a fund that aggregates and you know that in addition to the half a million, you also need to keep some money aside to pay tax.
Richard Taylor:
[00:29:15 – 00:29:20]
But then when that fund disgorges, you’ll effectively have paid your taxes along the way. Right, so it’s.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:29:20 – 00:30:02]
Yeah, yeah, then, exactly. Then you would have resolved your cash flow issue. Or you can invest in a fund that takes it into account and distribute, makes annual distributions at least to cover your tax burden. Which was something that we are advising a fund that we’ve been involved with the creation of to do because we know Americans might need this. I mean not everyone, some people have half a million and a lot more, right? I mean it depends on people financial situation. But if you just have half a million, then if you invest in a fund and you want to take the cash flow issue into account, you might want to talk to the fund about what’s its distribution policy.
Richard Taylor:
[00:30:03 – 00:32:01]
I’m excited to announce that Expat wealth has its first sponsor, the Global Financial Planning Institute. The GFPI exists to provide education, community tools, resources and ongoing research for financial planners and other advanced financial professionals working with international and cross border clients in the US and Americans abroad. I’m a GFP Institute fellow and I’ve put all our employees through their GFPI programs when they join us. I’ve met some great people, I’ve learned a ton. It’s a genuine community of internationally minded folk doing their best to serve their clients properly and critically sharing what they know in the oftentimes challenging and ambiguous US Cross border environment. And as anyone in this sector will tell you, you’re always learning. So if you work with international clients and or Americans abroad or if this is area you’re looking to get into, check out the gfpi@www.gfp.in stute you will be glad you did and I hope to see you there soon. This is super interesting. I’ve got to, I’ll be honest with you. I, I just thought, I hear PFIC and I shut down immediately. You know, I, I just, so I just assumed. Golden Visa, pfic. Pfic Bad American shouldn’t touch. But, but, but what you’re laying out is totally doable, totally serviceable. Which is, which is great. I just want to, I’m gonna stray into dangerous territory for me, so feel free to. I say here the problems I alluded to with pfix and which you correctly pointed out is when people aren’t aware of this so they blindly go into a pfic whether voluntarily or whether they’ve been missile by someone who nefariously or that person is not aware of what a PFIC is with them in an American’s hands and they don’t make this election in year one. And if I understand it correctly, if you miss that election, you know, tough is gone. Yeah. And then the taxation of a PIFC gets really ugly really quickly, really bad.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:32:01 – 00:32:05]
Yeah. Then you pay progressive taxation at the end plus fine.
Richard Taylor:
[00:32:06 – 00:32:06]
Yeah.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:32:06 – 00:32:18]
So that would be a very high tax. So you definitely want to make a QAF election. I mean there’s no problem if the fund doesn’t make any money.
Richard Taylor:
[00:32:19 – 00:32:48]
Well, yeah, there is that, I guess. And not only that, not only are you looking at a punitive level of taxation plus interest penalties, but presumably also if this person is unaware of those requirements, are unaware of the reporting requirements, Form 8621. So then. Which is an annual reporting requires the IRS when you, when you have a pfic. So then they’re going to be out of compliance as well. And then there’s, there’s, there’s, you know, you know, all sorts of. Yeah. All sorts of issues that cascade from that.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:32:48 – 00:34:46]
Yeah, that’s very bad. I mean if you don’t, if you don’t report, it’s very bad. It’s, it can be enormous fines. And I think. Yeah, I mean I think there’s kind of two angles to this. One is that if someone lives, lived in the US all their lives and they’re not planning to move anywhere and their CPA is dealing with local clients and has never dealt with an expat before, then the CPA wouldn’t know how to file a PFIC forms on the tax return. So yeah, for someone who’s never done this before, this might look a bit scary. And then it’s a lot easier for the CP CPA to just say, hey, this is a mess, just don’t do it. But no, I mean it’s not that bad. You just need to know how to file the form. And the other bit is that as a pure investment, why would you want to invest in a foreign fund as a pure investment when you have so many investment products in the us it doesn’t make sense unless people don’t invest in Golden Visa funds because they think they’re great investment products. They invest in a Golden Visa fund because they want Portuguese residency. And then they tried considering that they tried to pick the best investment products. So sure, I mean if you write off the fact that you make the investment for residency and you just look at it as a pure investment product, it makes no sense. There’s lots of good things you can buy in the us Management fees of Golden Visa funds tend to be high. You have to invest 60% in Portugal. That’s quite limiting. You know, some people want to divest and invest in assets outside the us particularly now, but, but you can also do that through the us. You don’t have to go to a Portuguese fund. But you know, considering people do Golden Visa investments because they want the residency, the PFIC is, is basically admin and paperwork that you want to do properly, but once you do it properly, not a big deal.
Richard Taylor:
[00:34:47 – 00:35:05]
Super interesting. Right, before we get into the recent changes that I’d like to discuss, are there any other obvious immediate landmines that spring to mind? Things that people regularly fall afoul of that are just easy to avoid if you’re in the know?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:35:05 – 00:37:06]
Yeah, maybe one thing of the funds that is a kind of a reflection of a bigger problem. In addition to not all funds are necessarily fully compliant with what they need to be though the market’s gotten a lot more sophisticated than what it was. There is a heavily marketed play of investing in Golden Visa fund through retirement accounts. So the general notion is you convert whatever retirement account you have into a self directed Iraq, which you can generally do whatever you want with, and then go ahead and invest your self directed IRA into a Golden Visa fund. And it’s heavily marketed, very irresponsibly. So a lot of the people marketing it, they don’t flag the Risk or they just say oh yeah, invest pre tax money. What’s better than this? It’s an amazing thing to do. And everyone wants to invest retirement account money. It’s pre tax money. The benefit is very clear. But self directed IRAs or any IRAs or any retirement accounts are not allowed to invest in something that provides a personal benefit. So there is a debate on whether the right to apply for Portuguese residency is a personal benefit or just the residency itself is a personal benefit. And yes, it’s subject to a separate process. Yes, it’s not, it doesn’t give you a monetary benefit necessarily but the law doesn’t say that it needs to give a monetary benefit. It just says that you can’t invest in something that gives you or your fiduciary can’t invest in something that gives the beneficiary a personal benefit. So there is a debate. So some lawyers, they see this as a big no, no and, and see the Portuguese residency as a personal benefit. And some people say no, it’s fine, I’m in the more cautious camp. I don’t like it.
Richard Taylor:
[00:37:07 – 00:37:21]
Why run that risk? I appreciate for some people it might be their only option. But if it’s your only option, even more reason not to do it because you’re playing with your own eretirement pot. Don’t go near that until that’s settled and don’t be the test case.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:37:21 – 00:37:55]
Yeah, I don’t like it. I think if, but generally I’m a tax lawyer, right? I’m. Sometimes we take aggressive positions but it’s okay to take an aggressive position if you’re a sophisticated. So first of all you need to be sophisticated and you also need to know that you’re taking an aggressive position. And when people come to us and ask us for advice on investing through retirement account, we explain the risk. And in not nine, in 99 out of 100 cases, once people understand the risk, they don’t want to do it.
Richard Taylor:
[00:37:55 – 00:38:06]
Zev, what is the risk? So someone takes a half a million out of their ira, invests it in one of these funds and it’s later determined not to be. Okay, what’s the repercussion?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:38:06 – 00:38:22]
The risk is that the entire retirement account would be considered to be distributed with early distribution fines taxes and then you need to pay taxes and then early distribution taxes and then if you need to pay back and you don’t pay back, it’s up to 100%.
Richard Taylor:
[00:38:23 – 00:38:23]
My gosh.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:38:24 – 00:38:29]
So it depends on, so the exposure depends on the size of your retirement.
Richard Taylor:
[00:38:30 – 00:38:30]
It’s Very.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:38:31 – 00:41:50]
It can be many hundreds of thousands of dollars in exposure. And then, and then some people say, well, but it never exploded before. To which the answer is, but people didn’t do it on such a scale before. The whole Americans investing in golden Visa funds in Portugal is a new thing. It started happening on a scale only in the last couple of years. And some CPAs won’t file the tax returns. We’re seeing that now. They’re saying, well, I can’t file the tax return because you have a personal benefit. So then people don’t know what to do. So they look for a different CPA that has a different interpretation. So very irresponsible. So that’s something that we see happening a lot and we really don’t like. And it’s kind of more of a reflection of generally a wider industry that you are dealing with a cross border issue. So you can’t expect a cross border issue. You need to think about the cross border. You need to think about the US side and you need to think about the Portuguese side. And you can’t expect the Portuguese advisor alone to fully advise you on the US side and vice versa. And we see. Here’s another example, people come to Portugal with S Corps. So Americans come to Portugal with S Corps. S corps are a very good way to trade when you live in the US because you pay less Social Security. So CPAs love them to say, why would you trade in an LLC or the direct normal self employed. If you can trade through an S corp, you’ll pay less tax banks. But S corps don’t work in most countries and they certainly don’t work in Portugal. Because what is an S corp? It’s a strange entity that converts what would have otherwise been self employment income into a combination of employment income and profits in a transparent entity. It doesn’t exist anywhere else. But employment income should be taxed where you live and work. So your S corp is supposed to register in Portugal and withhold tax taxes in Social Security. Good luck trying to get the Social Security back in the US after this. It’s possible, but it’s very, very hard. And then if it’s a corporate, then the Portugal would want you to pay corporation tax so you lose all the benefit of the transparency. So it’s a complete disaster to trade with an S corp. And we argue sometimes people come with their CPAs and they say that CPAs are not used to thinking about someone living overseas. And they say, yeah, yeah, and you know, keep working with an S corp. And it’s like no, you move to Portugal, you need to get rid of your S Corp. It’s not going to work unless you have US based partners and you’re going to be completely passive and we have to structure it. But people just don’t always think, think everything through and it’s, it’s, and they don’t always appreciate the complexity. So I think it’s, and some people do, you know, some people are like, okay, I know I move in countries, tell me what I need to do. I know, I know nothing. You know, I want to learn this. And then, and then it’s okay. And then, and we have people sometimes contacting us three years before they want to move, which is incredible. You know, I can’t book a holiday three months before.
Richard Taylor:
[00:41:50 – 00:42:08]
No, but I appreciate those people and I appreciate people who come with that kind of mentality. And then there’s the other one is the one who I imagine contacts you three years in and I’ve started to realize they’ve stepped on some landmines and they want your help getting off them without doing too much damage. Right. And a lot of that then is too little too late.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:42:08 – 00:42:24]
Yeah, yeah. I mean, you’re dealing with Americans, right? I mean, you know, how many Americans live overseas and never file a U.S. tax return? So, yeah, I mean, definitely. And we see that in Portugal as well. People who have been living in Portugal for years and haven’t, haven’t filed tax returns. And it was like, yeah, this, this is, this is a bit of a problem.
Richard Taylor:
[00:42:25 – 00:42:38]
Great. Right. Well, I’ve alluded to it a few times. Big changes in Portugal. Right. Just, just in the last couple of weeks, something got signed into law and I’ve seen some of your posts on LinkedIn. It seems like tr afoot. So can you, what’s going on there?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:42:38 – 00:43:27]
Yeah, I, I, I’m, yeah. So both positive and, and negative, by the way. So everyone is talking about the changes in, in the nationality law. This, this is the, the, it’s a very loud subject, the very loud topic. But there’s, there’s also something very important that sort of gone unnoticed. But, but I think it makes a much more of a difference in people’s lives than, than this particular change is that that Portugal has a new tax benefit regime called ifisi. That’s what replaced what used to be nhr. And we’ve had the first cohort of people that applied for efisi approved on 31 March. And it’s a great tax regime. It’s pretty much as good as the old one. But because it’s a little bit more complicated to deal with the mechanics of it, a lot of people don’t know about it.
Richard Taylor:
[00:43:27 – 00:43:42]
Wait, Zeb. Sorry. This is actually something, we’re not talked about, the tax regime. So we’ve talked about immigration, we’ve talked about landmines. But then you’re right, we should have touched on, like, and it sounds very relevant because we literally talk about it now. But how are people, how are Americans going to be taxed in Portugal?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:43:43 – 00:44:04]
So, I mean, either very high progressive taxation on all of their income if they don’t think about their taxes, or if they get into the new tax regime, which is very much possible, it require, again, it requires effort and structuring and good advice. But if they get into the new tax regime, they can have a full exemption over all of their income, apart from their retirement income.
Richard Taylor:
[00:44:05 – 00:44:16]
Is this something you actually have to apply for? You know, I come to America, I mean, I’m in the tax system, I don’t have to apply for anything. I just, I’m in it. But is this like you actually have to make an actual application? I qualify for this.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:44:17 – 00:44:20]
You have to apply. And if you don’t apply on time, you lose it forever.
Richard Taylor:
[00:44:20 – 00:44:24]
Oh, wow. Like the FIFA collection. Okay.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:44:24 – 00:45:30]
Yeah, yeah. It’s very deadline strict on deadlines, and you have to prepare for it. You have to meet the criteria, you have to apply and you have to do it by the 15th of January, the year after you came. So you really need to do this properly. But if you do it properly, you can have a 10 year exemption on all of your foreign income apart from retirement income. So capital gains in securities, capital gains from real estate, rental income, dividends, interest, royalties, all of these things can be exempt for 10 years, if you think about this and structure it properly. And it’s a great regime. And once again, Portugal completely messed up the communication. They just said, well, we’ve canceled the previous regime, which kind of did the same thing, and we’ve introduced a new one that’s a lot more restrictive, but it’s not really that restrictive. It’s applied generously if you know what you’re doing. So, yeah, I mean, at the end of March, we saw, we saw the first cohort working, and that’s much bigger news for us than the entire nationality debate, which is important, but it’s, it’s just timing.
Richard Taylor:
[00:45:35 – 00:45:50]
Well, just before we talk about it, can I just make sure I understand this correctly? So I moved Portugal, I applied for and accepted into this new regime for 10 years. All my all my income, other than my retirement income, which I don’t actually have, but all my income.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:45:51 – 00:45:52]
All your non Portuguese.
Richard Taylor:
[00:45:52 – 00:46:01]
All my non Portuguese income, other than my retirement income is, is exempt from Portuguese tax. But I’m an American, so I’m still, I still taxed in America.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:46:01 – 00:46:02]
Nothing can help you with that.
Richard Taylor:
[00:46:02 – 00:46:08]
No, but I get, I get the hundred thousand foreign income. Oh no, it would be foreign earned income, would it? So I wouldn’t get the exemption.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:46:08 – 00:46:23]
It normally. Yeah, I mean it would be the 130 or so. It’s foreign earned income. So. But we’re talking mainly about passive income. So you’ll still pay tax in the U.S. but the tax in Portugal is a lot higher on these type of income.
Richard Taylor:
[00:46:23 – 00:46:29]
Yeah. Okay, great. And then after 10 years that expires and everything’s taxable in Portugal.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:46:29 – 00:48:09]
Is that how that works? Generally, yes, though there’s a lot of ways to reduce taxation, even under Portuguese domestic legislation. Again, you need to look for these things. So for example, if you buy a rental property and you rent it for a long time, there’s reduced taxation. If you buy securities and you hold them for a long time, the taxation goes down. If you buy private equity funds, the taxation is reduced. And if you’re wealthy enough, you can create your own private equity fund and hold your assets through that. So there’s a lot to do to, to reduce tax, but they are usually quite a complicated play. This tax regime. It’s meant for people to, it’s meant for expats, it’s meant for people to come. It’s not automatic qualification. You need to meet the qualifying criteria. So you need to get involved in some way in the Portuguese ecosystem. But that’s something we and others facilitate. So it’s definitely doable. Italy has a 300,000 a year scheme that gives pretty much the same benefit. It’s very similar in its benefits and it’s super difficult. I mean, 300,000 a year is a lot of money. It’s multi millionaires play and it’s very popular and you can get the same or even better outcome in Portugal at a fraction of that cost. Just as structuring and nobody knows, I suppose because it’s new, but also because of really poor communication. So yeah, for us, the fact that this works and works well is bigger news than nationality.
Richard Taylor:
[00:48:10 – 00:48:12]
What is a nationality citizenship thing?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:48:12 – 00:51:18]
So there’s, yeah, again, two angles to this. One is that, okay, Portugal’s decided to change the rules. And it used to be after five years of living in Portugal, you used to be able to apply for a nationality and now it’s 10. And also it’s. It was 5 from the first application for residency and now it’s 10 from the actual receipt of the residence card, which can take time. So it’s a much longer timeline, but you can still apply for permanent residency after five years. So it’s not such a big issue. But the way it’s been done again, so it’s not as much what’s happening, but it’s the way it’s been done. Portugal should have properly grandfathered everyone, and it looks like it’s not doing it. So the legislation is in its final stages of being approved. But basically what the Portuguese politicians are saying is that we’ve never promised access to nationality within five years. We’ve only ever dealt with residency. And being able to apply for nationality based on the law that was effective at the time was a side benefit of coming to Portugal. And it wasn’t an inherent part of any particular program. And that’s what the government’s essentially saying. It’s not that we’re not grandfathering, it’s just there’s nothing to grandfather. This is a completely unrelated issue. And the reason they’re doing this, this is important to understand that the reason that they’re doing this has nothing to do with American or British or people from wealthier countries. Let’s call it this way. It’s a response to political pressure from the right to try and block hundreds of thousands of low skilled migrants, primarily from Southeast Asia, to access citizenship. All the wealthier people are collateral damage, speaking in modern terms. And it’s not that they particularly care about this demographic, but it’s not like they’re trying to mess up the Golden Visa program. They’re trying to respond to pressure about immigration from the right. And as they do that, they’re making it difficult for everyone to get to access nationality. But the issue is that mainly with Golden Visa, so people with normal residency that already live in Portugal and just need to wait longer, it’s not such a big issue because people will continue to be residents with pretty much the same rights. But people that applied for golden visa primarily between 2021 and 2024 had one problem after another. We’ve been very unlucky because the processing of their applications has been very slow because of the first because of the pandemic, then because of the systematic errors. So a lot of them haven’t received what was promised. A lot of the Golden Visa programs have been marketed quite aggressively with the focus on the citizenship being Very strong. So they feel that. That citizenship has been promised as part of the deal.
Richard Taylor:
[00:51:18 – 00:51:25]
So they thought they were on a countdown. They are, like, three years left, but now they’ve got eight years. Looks like they’re have eight. All right. So, yeah. Okay. So they’re just feeling a bit aggrieved.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:51:25 – 00:51:29]
Yeah. Even if even people that have, like, a few months to go, they suddenly have 10 years to go.
Richard Taylor:
[00:51:29 – 00:51:34]
Wait, not. Not another five years. They have. It just like, adds 10 years to it.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:51:34 – 00:52:04]
Yeah, yeah, that’s. That’s. That’s the thing. So it was just. It’s. It’s a group that has. Very unfortunately, because before that, people, before 2021, their golden visas were processed quite quickly, and most of them have already reached the five years. So it’s this particular cohort that had problem after problem after problem after problem. And now they’re being told after you’ve done all of this and you’ve paid all of these fees, you can’t apply for a nationality. You can still apply for permanent residency, but not for nationality anymore.
Richard Taylor:
[00:52:04 – 00:52:04]
Anymore.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:52:05 – 00:54:13]
And the ones that had significant delays in the issuing of their cards, and there’s lots of people in that situation, they cannot even apply for permanent residency yet, because now they’re counting from the cards. I think there’s maybe between three and four thousand people in this situation. And they are very, very, very upset. And their take is, you know, we just can’t trust Portugal. It’s just not a reliable country. And I completely see why they feel this way. They’ve been, you know, some would say, very unlucky. Some would say, you know, intentionally targeted. You know, definitely some of them feel this way. I don’t think they were intentionally targeted, but they have very good reasons to be upset. And they. There is a reputational damage to the golden visa program in Portugal because of. Not of this change, but because of the way that the change has been done. And I still hope. I think we were sort of hoping after the first round, and it was in the parliament, and then it went to the court, and the court knocked it out for different reasons. And we were sort of hoping that the politicians will come to their senses and insert grandfathering into this legislation, but they haven’t done that. And eventually they voted again with the far right to pass it as it is, because this is, again, this is not about money or about golden visa at all. It’s about trying to Block 300, 400,000 people from Pakistan, Bangladesh, India work as Uber drivers and delivery couriers to obtain citizenship, which is Something that’s on the agenda of the far right in Portugal and the center right is trying to eat into this voter base that cares about these things. One of the outcomes is that very wealthy Americans or not so wealthy Americans, moderately wealthy Americans, are feeling very bad and rightfully so.
Richard Taylor:
[00:54:13 – 00:54:18]
To kind of clarify, I understand this. So you get a gold. You get a golden Visa card.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:54:19 – 00:54:19]
Not.
Richard Taylor:
[00:54:19 – 00:54:36]
Not when you apply for it. You get, you get your golden visa. You then have five years to on that before you can apply for permanent residency. Then you have to do 10 years before you can get citizenship. Is that right? Okay, so it’s a 15. Once you get that visa, it’s a 15 year process to citizenship.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:54:36 – 00:54:37]
Yeah, pretty much.
Richard Taylor:
[00:54:37 – 00:54:50]
Great. Look, this has been. Sue, I have learned so much. I thought I knew a fair bit about this, but I’ve learned so much. So it’s been great. Is there anything else you want to share before we go? And if not, can you just tell people where they can find you?
Zeev Fisher:
[00:54:50 – 00:54:59]
Well, we’ve been talking for almost an hour. I mean, I think if, if your listeners are not tired by now, they probably want to see at least me go.
Richard Taylor:
[00:55:01 – 00:55:08]
I think people, anyone who’s thinking about making this movie, this has been an absolute goldmine of information. So I hope they’ve. I hope they’ve lasted this long.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:55:08 – 00:55:33]
It’s my pleasure, Richard. Yeah. And if anyone has any questions, then I think you know where to find me. So feel free to relay. Relay that. Me and my colleagues. So feel free to relay the information. It’s been very nice speaking to you. Yeah. No expectation that you’ll be fully up to date on everything that’s happening in Portugal. I joke a lot with my friends that as a child, running a law firm in Portugal was not exactly in the cards.
Richard Taylor:
[00:55:34 – 00:55:47]
No. No. Well, I mean, it sounds like it wasn’t until the virus none of us were expecting came on us and circumstances. And that is another reason why I love working with expats is just, just, you know, these stories.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:55:48 – 00:55:48]
That is.
Richard Taylor:
[00:55:48 – 00:56:13]
That’s an interesting story. Look, what’s, what’s. What emerge out of it. Full service. What do you say? 17 Lawyers, two accountants. I love that kind of thing. So congrats on your success. I like what you’re doing. I think this has been a super interesting conversation. Portugal sounds wonderful. You’ve got me thinking. And I’m gonna go and talk to my wife now. Every time I have all these conversations, I’m like, right, I’m moving. Great to chat with you. Thank you so much for coming on Expat wealth and hope to see you soon.
Zeev Fisher:
[00:56:13 – 00:56:18]
My pleasure. Very, very nice to chat with you. And yeah, hope to see you soon too.
Richard Taylor:
[00:56:18 – 00:57:16]
All right folks, that’s another episode of Expat wealth under our belts. Thank you for listening. I appreciate it. And I appreciate you. If you’re enjoying the show and would like to support the mission, which is to help ambitious expats thrive in America and ask you to subscribe to the POD wherever you listen and also consider leaving a rating and review. This stuff really does matter. Please help us get this information to the people, people who need it, that is. To your fellow expats. Just a quick reminder that this show is brought to you by Plan First Wealth. We are a US Based financial planner and wealth manager and we help successful American and international families living across the US to make the most of their opportunity and ultimately to retire happier. If you’d like to know more about how we might be able to help you, you can find us on our website, www.planfirstwealth.com or you can look me up on LinkedIn. Do get in touch. We’d love to hear from you. As always, thank you to the podcast guys for their help producing this episode and the entire show. See you next week.
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